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Thread: Burst

  1. #1
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    Burst

    Since the skills have been changed , I have noticed something odd. That my damage numbers are about the same no matter which level I use. Here are two examples from the same quest, Rescuing Soldiers medium.

    Quest 1:
    Zab shot a Burst II (SL 2) at the monsters
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel I (ATT 33% + ATT +22) : hit
    Damage dealt to Orc Sentinel I : 950 ( 342 +608 ) Physical HP
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel II (ATT 33% + ATT +22) : hit
    Damage dealt to Orc Sentinel II : 1050 ( 442 +608 ) Physical HP
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel III (ATT 33% + ATT +22) : hit
    Damage dealt to Orc Sentinel III : 1045 ( 437 +608 ) Physical HP



    Quest 2:
    Zab shot a Burst II (SL 50) at the monsters
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel I (ATT 33% + ATT +550) : hit
    Damage dealt to Orc Sentinel I : 765 ( 157 +608 ) Physical HP
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel II (ATT 33% + ATT +550) : critical failure!
    Zab shot at Orc Sentinel III (ATT 33% + ATT +550) : hit
    Damage dealt to Orc Sentinel III : 793 ( 185 +608 ) Physical HP


    I never really get damage much over 1000, no matter what.

    I understand the need to balance the game, but I am not sure why taking away the strength of attack or changing scout skills has to do with this. Especially when you have made wizards vastly more powerful than they were before. You stated in another thread that single shot attacks for scouts and multi-attacks for wizards are each's specialty, but every wizard I have spoken to now prefers their single shot skills and most scouts preferred their multi-attacks (or at least Burst) before the update. Average playing scouts (non-payers) have become very neutered when using this skill. I really do not like the fact that you changed the way Burst works mostly because EVERY OTHER GUILD has a special ring they can purchase to enhance the potency of their skills, but scouts do not. Burst was one of the things that made up for that. I would not mind if it took me until Burst III or even IV to get back my once over 90% of my attack per use, but I would like it back someway.

  2. #2
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    Also, if I could touch on Rain of Arrows briefly.... the failure rate of that skill is still incredibly high. I am not sure how the damage numbers work there (is it just based on our attack?), but it would be nice if we still hit at least three targets with a chance to hit more... maybe you could use the current set up of Burst damage for Rain of Arrows instead.....
    Last edited by Zab; October 31st, 2013 at 10:11.

  3. #3
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    Boo, I thought the title read Bust. ( . Y . )

  4. #4
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    Any way I think this is what Zab is complaining about.

    Rastlin fired a Power Missile IV (SL 50) at Dire Frost Alpha Wolf I (ATT +4544 , Magical Damage +994) : hit
    Damage dealt to Dire Frost Alpha Wolf I : 1951 ( 690 +1261 ) Magical HP
    Dire Frost Alpha Wolf I resisted the effect of Frozen

    It will get nasty when I get PM5



  5. #5
    Developer - Managing Director Alex's Avatar
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    Burst: Seeing your attacks, seems as if the effective skill's ATT score is not being counted to the damage but the normal ATT score. In this skill, the ATT used for the burst attacks should be the ATT score counted both for the hit and damage. So using 1 SL will give you practically 3 attacks with 1/3 chance hit and 1/3 damage each, compared to your usual attack. The same idea here for fighter's chain attack.

    Rain of Arrows works different. In burst, scout fires 3 quick shots to 3 selected targets, and these attacks are usually lower than one usual attack. But here, scout fires a rain of arrow over the enemy party, and every enemy may receive an arrow randomly. This chance for every target to get an attack, depends ONLY of SL used, Scout's xp level, and target's xp level, and of course, luck (the chance roll). This works better with lower targets and not so good with higher targets. Once we have determined what targets will receive an attack, we make a standard attack against these targets, with full ATT score for hit and for damage. Notice that even when a target receive an attack, it could finally miss.

    Rastlin's Power Missile: This skill is thoroughly balanced. With 1 ene cost, wizard's Power Missile gets +5ATT, +1DAM, scout's Aimed Shot gets +10ATT, and fighter's Mighty Blow gets a +1d4DAM. In fact, the better part is for the scouts here, as this is against one only target (the advantage is slight, though). The problem with wizards generally and with Rastlin particularly is the spells boost. As I said in other thread, we have to take a decission to restrict this boost as spells are getting crazy. We have already some ideas about it.

    Respecting to the skills and rings to boost cries/prayers/spells, we gave to scouts a skill to boost XP, and consequently, levels. In fact, we think that scouts get again the very very best part here, specially when we restrict spells boost. So much better advantage that we could not restrict the XP boost medallion only for scouts.

    Of course, though the main is already done with skills, we could and should ge deeper in every skill to tune up them. We have already done based in averages (average damage per energy point spent, per levels, etc), but always is better do it with out testers, so I appreciate so much these kind of constructive threads. We need ambushes!

  6. #6
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    Boo my Spell boost isn't that high. I remember when you could use multiple boosting item now that was fun. We are all ready restricted to one item how else could you limit the boost?

  7. #7
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    Just change Burst back to increased % to hit instead of increased attack.

  8. #8
    Developer - Managing Director Alex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zab View Post
    I never really get damage much over 1000, no matter what.
    We have reviewed the code and it is fine, it does what we expected.

    I see in the logs you posted that they are before our update which reviewed burst/chain (I can see it in the syntax (ATT 33% + ATT +22) which we changed to (ATT 33% +22).

    Please make again the test. Higher SL must make indeed a better damage and better hit chance. But keep in mind this:

    - If you fight orcs with 100-300 defense, and you have several Ks in Attack, you will almost always hit with only 33% of your attack, so no matter really how many SL you use. Against higher monsters, you will notice the increase in the hit chance raising your SL.
    - Damage dealt for your attack/skill is the first number in the brackets. In you increase your SL in 50 levels, you will notice that this number will be increased around 60 points average on Burst I, around 140 points average on Burst II, around 250 points average on Burst III... The final damage dealt is this amount plus the damage bonus from your weapon and from your skill (poison skill which only have the scouts). In your post you may see your weapon add around 600 damage! This is always added so the damage from your attack/skill may be unpercevied because this huge damage bonus.

  9. #9
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    "...so no matter really how many SL you use" In other words, basically a useless skill in the future to upgrade. i realise what you are saying about my added physical damage, but I do notice I am only hitting between 300-400 no matter the skill level in normal damage.

    "...increase your SL in 50 levels, you will notice that this number will be increased around 60 points average on Burst I, around 140 points average on Burst II, around 250 points average on Burst III..." I am closer to level 60 and I do not see this increase, except maybe once or twice and typically only on a crit. Makes this an expensive and time consuming skill to upgrade and enhance for little profit.

    I get that all our skills cannot be super fantastic, but again, I think you need to change this. And the fighter's Chain Attack too (which is even more expensive and time consuming to upgrade and enhance) When unpaying scouts (or fighters) are hitting 60 damage on skill level 40.... seriously, by the time they upgrade to that point... and some never will because of the cost and rate they make skill points per hour, it well... sucks because honestly... what level 40 or higher player wants to make so little damage after all that time invested? It does practically nothing to the monsters at their levels unless you have added physical damage. These were some of the better skills for both guilds. It also gave scouts something fun to do early on with their skills. Aimed Shot seldom still does more damage than an average attack, Burst is blah, Surprise Attack is typically an average attack too, success rate of other skills is sort of mediocre and one has to wait until level 95 to get crit shot II, which may or may not be decent, I am still working on it....



  10. #10
    Developer - Managing Director Alex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Hadley View Post
    Boo my Spell boost isn't that high. I remember when you could use multiple boosting item now that was fun. We are all ready restricted to one item how else could you limit the boost?
    We won't restrict the item, item will be the same. We are thinking on changing the way that the speels boost affect to the skills, as spells direct damage cannot be mutiplied so much, it would break the game. The idea is that a fireball with double potence not necessarily should make double damage. Maybe the bonus could affect the carter's level or attack when compared to the target's level or defense, instead affecting directly to the SL used and then to the number of dices of damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Hadley View Post
    Just change Burst back to increased % to hit instead of increased attack.
    Burst always workerd the same, always was modifying just the ATT score. The difference is that before, each SL gave you +1% ATT to the 33% ATT base, and now instead +1, it give +5 ATT /SL (potence I), +11 ATT /SL (potence II), etc
    Percentile increases are tiny for low players and crazy for high players. Linear increases are better here. New Burst in better than the older one, for players with ATT <500, Burst II is better for players with ATT < 1100, Burst III is better for ATT scores < 2000, etc. Always, linear increases are more useful first, but the effect is each time less perceived. The reason of the potence levels was to counteract this obsolescence, and keep the usefulness all the time if you enhance your skills.

    At this point we think that burst, chain, etc are very well as they are now. If spells were out of control, the way to solve it is not to increase all other skills, but control the spells to the point we really planned for them.

    I would like to hear everybody's ideas to moderate spells? limit spell boost, limit the way the spall boost increase spells? or just reduce spells' base damage?

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